iamfreeru2 wrote:I know you to believe I am confusing the terms, but am I really? I would like for you to start that other thread, if you would be so kind.
I have a question for you. The Northwest Territory that was given to The United States of America in the Treaty of Paris, A.D. 1783, is it land, an area, a possession, and property? Was The United States of America not given a proprietary (ownership) interest in that territory, area, possession, and property, when it was won from Great Britain by conquest?.
I don't think so. I believe that it was given back to those who held the charters in the colonies. The colonies/perpetual union then ceded their interests in the land to the "united states" for the benefit of the people. The "united states" then had to purchase what they were claiming from the Indians. After the war, soldiers could choose pensions or bounties of land west of the Appalachians. They then went through the process of survey, warrant, return of survey, then patents. At some point the BLM was created, and at some point they held back certain lands. It never affected me as to what happened west of the Appalachians, so I have not spent a lot of time studying it. But that is my understanding.
4 U.S. Code § 110(d) The term “State” includes [is limited to] any Territory or possession of the United States.(e) The term “Federal area” means any lands or premises held or acquired by or for the use of the United States or any department, establishment, or agency, of the United States; and any Federal area, or any part thereof, which is located within the exterior boundaries of any State, shall be deemed to be a Federal area located within such State.
If the term State “is limited to” any Territory or possession of the United States, then federal area can only mean the same thing. “[O]r for the use of the United States” does not mean United States does not have a proprietary (ownership) interest.
You may want to dig a little deeper...
Which "United States" are they talking about? You know there are no less than 4, right?
What do "acquired" and "held" mean?
What does "deemed" mean?
No, Federal Area does not mean the same thing as State.
I know you know this. Think planes of jurisdiction. The Federal Area is an overlay.
Black’s Law Dictionary, 5th and 6th Editions
Acquire – To gain by any means, usually by one’s own exertions; to get as one’s own; to obtain by search, endeavor, investment, practice, or purchase; receive or gain in whatever manner; come to have. In law of contracts and of descents, to become owner of property; to make property one’s own; to gain ownership of. Sometimes used in the sense of “procure.” It does not necessarily mean that title has passed. Includes taking by devise.
Held/Hold – 2. To be a grantee or tenant of another
; to take or have an estate from another. Properly, to have an estate on condition of paying rent, or performing service
. 6. To administer
; to conduct or preside at; to convoke, open, and direct the operations of; 8. To possess; to occupy; to be in possession and administration of; as to hold office. 9. To keep; to retain; to maintain possession of or authority over.
Deem – To hold; consider; adjudge; believe; condemn; determine; treat as if
Black’s Law Dictionary, 7th Edition, 1999
Deem – 1. To treat (something) as if (1) it were really something else, or (2) it has qualities that it doesn’t have. “Deem is a useful word when it is necessary to establish a legal fiction either positively by ‘deeming’ something to be something it is not
or negatively by ‘deeming’ something not to be something which it is…”G.C. Thornton, Legislative Drafting 83-84 (2d ed. 1979)
BTW, I'm not assenting to your other claims by not replying. I'm just trying to keep the thread clean and on point. There are a million and one rabbit trails that could be taken, I do better at tackling one at a time.